Height and scale?
 

For the MFCA Skills competition I am researching what distance a real 40 yard dash would be in relationship to the men in production.

In the photo I have lined up various men from Tudor, Miggle, Buzzball and FF.com. Each is in more or less a similar position. The lines on the card are 1/4 inch each.

It is easy to see that these are all different scales just like model railroads have N, HO, O and many other scales.

So my question is: assuming that these figures are based on an NFL pro player of aproximately 6 foot tall can we say that 1 1/4 inch equals 6 feet or what formula would be accurate?

What are your thoughts?
Do you also believe that these figures are based on 6 foot tall players?
Should they be classified as 2 or maybe 3 different scales?

If the manufacturers had a scale in mind, I would like to know what they based the sizes on. Maybe Reg and George could chime in on their thought process on this. I know that this has been discussed in the past but I would like to reopen it for those who were not around back then.

Gotta bump this. Somebody has got to have an opinion.

i have always noticed that most of the figures are around the same height/scale as the fantasy rpg figures that i collect. they are of 25mm scale, or 5mm = approx. 1 foot.
i don't believe that the different heights in the figures matters, from what i have seen there is not a drastic enough difference to seperate them into different scale categories. as a matter of fact, i am thinking of eventually making a team with all companies figures just to have different heights on the field. i.e. the regular miggle figures be scaled to be doug flutie or darren sproles size, etc..
as long as they all fit on the same sized base, they all have to travel the same amount of distance, the only factor may be weight.
don't know if this is the type of answer that you are looking for, but, it's something.:D

good points on that 5-13
 

i don't know if we are ready to break things down to that level, Wolf.

I use all figures on most of my teams with the exception of FF.com which the next team will have lots of...... of all the figures available these days, it would a shame not to be able to use them all.

That's one of the reason why used to collect teams - so I can use some original 67 figures to play certain spots, hogleg RB/WR to play some skill positions, BB CC to play on the O-line beside Repro blockers and repro 67 Tackles....etc.

5-13... I have some Gothom figures that are small enough to use as the below 5-10 guys.

once I get my camera working again, I will post up some shots of the different figures....

bump for eagles fan

Scale
 

Wolf,

When I built my big field, I used 1/2" for 1 yard as I am 6' tall personally and just like the ones you have pictured above, I struggled with the scale to use. I originally figured the 1-1/4" figure you came up with, but instead, elected to round down to 1" = 6' which got me to the 1/2" = 1 yard. My big board rounds out nicely at 60" long end line to end line at the 1/2" = 1 yard scale. If I had used the 1-1/4" factor to a true scale, the yard equivelant would have equaled .683" = 1 yard, the board would have been a LOT bigger almost 80" end line to end line. And it was just a little bit more manageable to round down to 1" = 6' translating to 1 yard = 1/2" as it was easier to build and for those who've played on it...it's big enough.

I ran this scale argument in my head back and forth sideways and front, taking into account the average size of all current NFL quarterbacks (which averaged out to about 6'-2" or 6'-3" {I've lost my notes on it}) and then after racking my brain, I just decided to go with the height with the bases to come up with 1" = 6'. It made for rounder numbers and a nice scale to play the game on.

I don't know if this helps you or not, but that's what I came up with 10 years ago when I started designing my board.

Jerry

Me Too
 

Good points, Jerry. I use the same 1:6 ratio in all of my calculations and feel that is the most accurate way to do it.

I actually agree with what you are saying but wanted to raise some points of discussion. I have built a KC All time team using all the sizes based on real height and weigth proportions. They are in Guttmanns inbox right now awaiting some color.

Because I got NO discussion on this when I originally posted it I made an executive decision for the MFCA and went with 5mm = 1 foot as that seemed to be the closest to representing the average heigth of the players. I would love to be able to say that MF is 25 mm scale. It would mean so much more to the average Joe on the street if we had a scale to qualify what we are doing.
We have all had models as kids and are use to collecting these as well as other things based on the scale. It would also keep any new manufacturers from coming along and creating taller figures and instead could create to the 25 mm scale. The New Mcfarlanes for example are not 25 mm scale and thus are not 25 mm miniature football figures even if you do find a way to put them on a base. Now we have the start of, as model railroading does, N scale, HO scale etc...

If you use the 5mm = 1 ft a 1 1/4 inch figure is about 6 6 ft 5 in (Oh for advanced math skills now-:D )

If you use 1/2 inch = 1 yard a 1 1/4 inch figure is 7ft 6 in. tall

Math guys-is this correct?

I did a little more research and if we say that a figure that is 1 1/4 inch (31.75 mm) tall is = to a 6 ft man then actuall millimeters would be a hair shy of 5.3 mm = 1 foot.

i'll look into this a little bit more, but i believe that your 5.3=1foot is the exact same as 25mm scale.
here's a link that might help (or create confusion).
http://theminiaturespage.com/ref/scales.html

Bump
 

5-13 and Wolf,

I was just looking at miniature figure scale size and was wondering if our current figures fall more closely to 25mm or 28mm scale. I'm curious to your thoughts on this.

Based on the measurements of miniatures being to eye level instead of top of the head it appears that they are to the 28mm scale (28mm~6 foot). For example, lets assume the hati repro DB was 6' tall. The height of the hati repro DB is ~30.5mm (~32-1.5 platform thickness). The head length is ~5mm so the measurement to the eyes would be ~28mm (30.5-2.5).

The FF.com and 67 big men figures appear slightly taller and the little Miggle guys are slightly shorter. I guess if you bunch the population of all these figures together to get variation in height it looks like overall the 28mm scale would more appropriately fit the combination of figures that we currently use. Therefore the 28mm scale is 1/58, whereas the 25mm scale is considered 1/64.

Any thoughts? 5-13 I'm a little confused by the 25/28mm scale. What scale do you think is most appropriate to our current configuration of figures, 1/58 or 1/64?

Thanks,
Joe

i agree that the figures fall closer to the 28mm scale. however, i always post them as 25/28mm because somewhere in the mid 80's, the wargaming sculptors cheated a little and started sculpting their 25mm scale figures a little larger for detail purposes. they actually weren't quite large enough for true 28mm scale items, so the tag 25mm stuck with them. occasionally you will find a figures labeled 25/28mm, but they are mostly labeled as 25mm.
i personally figure that going with 25mm is simply easier because it roughly turns out to be 5mm =1 foot. mf is probably in the in between range of scale, but 5mm=1 foot is easier to measure than 5.6mm=1 foot, imo.

Thanks for the quick feedback.

For some reason, I like to think of scale in terms of ratio, as in 1/64 or 1/72, etc. With the 25mm scale, which approximates the length of a figure's height to his EYES being 25mm, the figure's height is actually ~28mm tall. If our figures normal height is closer to 30-31mm then it definatly is closer to a true 28mm scale. Then again, the average players height is probably taller than 6 feet and helmets add to height, so a 25/28 scale seems right. Therefore the true MF scale that we play to today (for figures) would be closer to the 1/58 to 1/64 range instead of 1/72 (1/72 is the 5mm=1ft scale). Wolf's assessement of ~1.25" (~31.75mm) tall figures being equivalanet to a 6' tall figure is exactly the 1/58 scale. However, with the helmet adding height and the fact that the average NFL player is taller than 6', I would say the 1/64 scale may be the closest "standard" scale ratio to what we are playing with.

With the 1/64 scale ratio, a 6 foot tall player would be a1.125" tall miniature figure (72" * 1/64 = 1.125").
Joe

Bump for Mark Robins

guys, reguler small hotwheels and matchbox cars are 1:64.

There are scale rulers...
 

you can download or even purchase.

I used them when modelling in the 1/35 and 1/32 scale.

Just on mere observation I would say most EF/MF figures are close to 1/48th scale.

Bump
 

Bumping this back up because I believe that we (the MFCA) as a leading organization of miniature football should establish a standard scale for future manufactures to use in deciding what scale to use when making figures and gameboards. Or do we just go with the original scale and sizes used by Tudor.
I know they had many board sizes but I do believe the vintage 620's is the best size and what most people prefer.

Another Opinion
 

Wierdwolf,

Another way to look at the original question,
What should 40yards measure out to for skills competitions?,
would be to think about how fast figures are able to run.

For instance, if the average figure can run about 16" in 5 seconds, and the really fast figures can do it in 4 seconds, then this distance would be accurate and true for the EF world.

Think of it as reverse engineering:) It may be that this method doesn't work at all, but I thought it might be interesting to scale the figure's speed rather than the figure's size to field.

Can anybody add a photo with scale comparison including Jennings figures? I'd like to see how they compare with Buzzball, etc.