Time Spent Tweaking
 

A coach commented on another post that "no base should require that much tweaking", referring to a certain base and the length of time it takes to get something good out of it.

A question to all you guys who tweak your own bases, on average, how much do you or have you spent, tweaking one base in the past?

I think the answer will vary, as there are some gems that you hit on right off the bat and they are great performers in very little time, others take some time and work before they shine. Please post on your experiences on time spent on individual bases.

I would love to hear, as I am sure it will put this into perspective for those who are beginning.

Comments welcome from beginning tweakers to master tweakers.

From Weak To Strong To Weak Again
 

I had an experience a while ago that had me working with a base for about an hour; give or take a few minutes. The reason so much time was spent was due to the base’s erratic performance against one of my best defensive tackle bases.

This base started winning against my top lineman. When I thought no more tweaking was needed, the base began to fail miserably. It was getting thrown backwards. Have you ever seen the losing base keep sliding backwards after the board is turned off? That’s what this base was doing that kept me wanting to stay with it. So, I began to tweak this base some more.

The base again after further tweaking appeared as if it was trying to regain my love and admiration starting to push a little, then it would quit. This went on for about an hour. To no avail the base never again showed me what it had when I first tweaked it.

Basically, the base’s prongs didn’t hold their shape after they were tweaked. Heat didn’t make a difference. That base is somewhere among the other bases that didn’t work out for me. I will hold another combine with all of those bases that didn’t work out during my earlier camps.

Maurice

The Electric Coach

Which Team Was Better?
 

The 1972 "No Name Defense" DOLPHINS, engineered to perfection by Bob Griese and Don Shula or Barry Switzer's COWBOYS when JJ walked away?

One team of nobody's (moderately tweaked bases) with a BRILLIANT Coach vs. a team of highly tweaked/boiled bases with a Rookie Coach?

I don't consider myself a great tweaker nor a great Coach, but I do both to the best of MY ability and I have beaten some of the top Coaches in the country while losing to a few not-so-famous ones. Big deal. So what. I ENJOYED EVERY SINGLE PLAY OF EVERY SINGLE GAME. I think my guys handled their own and with sound football decisions have won more games than they've lost. Isn't that the point?

Everybody tweaks their bases to accomplish varying degrees of the same yet different unmeasurable tasks. Overall strength might be measured one on one as "Challenges" at Tourneys, but who cares if you have the STRONGEST TEAM ALIVE if it doesn't result in a Championship. Same with SPEED. Ya gotta put it ALL together. Speed, strength, assignments, execution, adjustments, ball control, time management, etc.

Tweaking is such a minuscule part of the game. I play with guys that have never touched flame nor pliers to their bases and give the best of the best a challenge. Imagine if they had equal bases???

Tweaking is like footwear. Would you rather wear Doc Martens, Chuck Taylors, Nikes, Kangaroos, Adidas, Pumas, Filas, Skechers, Hush Puppies, Dexters, etc? Different shoes for different surfaces for different coaching styles.

On the scale of footwear, my tweak is equivalent to Adidas (All Day I Dream About Squeezing the crap out of these friggin' prongs!!!!!) :rtfl: :rtfl: :rtfl:

OK Jimbo, with all due respect and I really mean that, I really do not understand your post and how it relates to my question. I too am not a master tweaker nor master coach, but I also do both to the best of my ability and am always learning to take both to the next level.

Now, what floors me is when you say that tweaking is a miniscule part of MF, I don't know where/who you play against, but if you step up against the dudes I play with out here in So Cal you will see that tweaking is indeed a major part of the game, we are now playing unboiled 4.0 in prep for the college series, you show up with untweaked bases and you'll spend all day watching your men get pushed from end to end. You played out here if I am not mistaken, in the Open Run we are now mostly non-boiled and 4.0 baby. I am not speaking of pure strength, pure speed, etc... you have to have a tweaked well balanced team, power and speed where you need them, directional control where it is needed and a combination of all of this at times where it is needed.

I don't get off on posting about strongest bases, fastest bases, etc...to play competitively in So Cal ONE MUST TWEAK. Coaching is a big part of winning in MF, but if your athletes can not execute then you are dead in the water and in for a long day.

I could buy a team of tweaked bases and show up and hold my own, but I won't, I will field a team with every base tweaked by ME, even if it takes me two years to get to where I could be in an instant had I paid someone to tweak for me.

I won't go that route, I got a few bases in trade from a well known tweaker and I use them as strength tests and frankly I have out done those few and they now reside in my junk pile. Tweaking is a must if you want to have a good day playing MF instead of showing up and getting manhandled all day.

Again, I am shocked that you think tweaking is a miniscule part of the game. I am actually floored. I do respect your opinion and position as a valuable MFCA member but you are way off on this one.

Jimbo,
?????????????????:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:
Jimbo take a chill pill.:cool:


Shabby J,
to answer your question. I have spent as little as a couple minutes to almost an hour on bases.
Also remember some bases just never quite perform up to par no matter what kind of spell you cast on it.
Average I suppose between 10-15 minutes. More on strength than speed.



Geno H

Jimbo, I agree with you on this one...
 

tweaking bases is a small part of coaching. If I have to tweak a base a lot just to make it serviceable, then I just won't use that base. A good coach does not need to tweak very much at all--I just think that base tweakers like tweaking--more power to ya!

I guess I am a.....
 

.......tweak geek....mtmstnks

I enjoy tweaking, to me it's just another part of the hobby, along with team building, painting, customizizing etc.

Shabby J, .........to answer your question I think most of the time if I am tweaking for speed, it takes about five minutes, and about 10 minutes for strength. That being said, I will stay with a base unit I think I can't get any more from it, or until I ruin it by over tweaking,...................Know when to say "when" ;)

I also believe tweaking is an ongoing process, when I play in a league, I routinely run my team the night before because the plastic bases have a memory and many times bases require a "quick going over" , but that is just me....

And if I can also add, when tweaking, sometimes you just have a magic touch and everything you tweak just turns out great and other times, you don't, and then it is time just to relax and do something else and come back later.

To each his own!
 

Personally, the more I learn how to tweak the more I enjoy it. It's great to go down to the bat cave, turn on some music (usually jazz for me), fix my favorite beverage (wine, whiskey...or what's ever in the cabinet) and spend a couple of hours tweaking bases. Very relaxing for me.

I agree with coach Rip. Some days I can quickly hit a base and it runs beautifully. Others, I can work on for half a day until I've made it useless (I've got a bunch of those!). I try to take the good with the bad and just enjoy it for what it is, a hobby.

DC

Ditto DC ...
 

I'm right there with ya',......... my musical tastes range from NFL Autum Thunder CDs' to rock-n-roll, to funk, to 70's rock and then my mp3 player has all the above and I have it all on "shuffle" :D

IMHO, I think the amount
of time spent on a base and how you see it is important is based on your MF involvement, if you don't have anyone to play with and just grab your stuff on the weekend and play yourself, then you want have to put much time into tweaking, but if your one of those coaches that go to 4 tournaments a year and play in 2 leagues in your state with some killer coaches, you will see tweaking in a whole different light, **you will comprehend** how important it is, it just depends on where your level of involvement is.

P.S. I spend 2 minutes on powerbases, 4 minutes on speedbases and about 2 minutes on ironmanbases.

P.S. my times are very short per base because I do this everyday for 4-6 hours, I have alottttttttttttt of practice (smile).

Norbert Revels

Wow! you're fast!!!!
 

Here's one for ya. Do you ever get tweaked bases from another tweaker? Are all your teams tweak by you, yourself, and the guy you see in the mirror!?

And if you do, who do you go to and why?

Nat'l

Hey Corey
 

July 30th, whats happening this year my man, we got to do something.

P.S. In the beginning I bought bases from alot of cats, (03-04), but as time went on I started to learn and read ALL the post on tweaking I could find, from 05 untill now I do my own teams.

Norbert Revels

I want to be like you when I grow up! Perhaps then I too can have a super hero assigned to me. :rtfl: :rtfl: :rtfl:

I know, our day is coming!!!!
 

It's on Wednesday. I will be leaving either the day after, or Friday for Canton. I will bring your gift with me. lol

I will probably fly into Cleveland. I have to get to the hotel from there? I might have to rent a car or something.

But as for Wednesday, I don't know if I will do anything special. I will celebrate with all the coaches of the MFCA during the convention.

I will take this time to remind everyone

Send in your money for the events before June 3rd!!!!!!!!!!!!

I will be attending all 3 events myself. It will be my party weekend!!!!

Back to tweaking. It's a good think I don't have to pay for a smoking or drinking habbit. I would have no money for bases!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't tweak to save my life. I'm pretty good at re-tweaking tho.

Nat'l

Gosh Golly, Shabby!?!
 

I'm shocked :eek: that you asked me a question and didn't like MY answer. Ok, I see that I didn't put a time measurement on it, but that was MY answer. ;)

Yes, I played in L.A. and found that my quick, assembly-line tweak was better than the boiled bases I traded for. TO ME, tweaking is easy, like Norbert said, and less important TO ME than learning my players so that I can execute my plays to perfection (which I can't unless my bases are tweaked) and calling the right play at the right time. thmbsp$

To answer YOUR 1st question, it takes me about 15 minutes per unit to get them on the field AND COMPETITIVE AGAINST ANYONE IN THE COUNTRY!!! ;) When I build a team, I organize them into 6 units: Backs, Receivers, OL, DL, LBs and DBs. A basic tweak is all I need to rock-n-roll. My Coaching will pick-up the slack and gametime situations will make or break me. What's wrong with that answer? In the overall time it takes me to get a team on the field - pimping out my team, drawing up plays for MY players based on THEIR talents - takes MORE TIME than tweaking them. IS THAT THE WRONG ANSWER?

I don't have to win every game that I play by any means necessary. I don't sell bases, so I'm not gonna break my hand tweaking to the "n"th degree just so my one guy is stronger and faster than your one guy. Who cares??? What can your 11 do against my 11? And if you're stronger than me, I'll have to compensate. If you're faster than me, I'll have to adjust. Or lose. WHOOPTY FRIGGIN' DOO-DOO. My manhood isn't measured by my Wins and Losses. I have ONLY played one game that I absolutely hated and that was because I was way too competitive for the situation. After that and since then, having fun, fellowshipping, sharing tips and strategies is more important than the outcome of the game. Win, Lose or Draw.

So again, in the whole spectrum of the game - TO ME - tweaking is not as important as everything else it takes to build a team. thmbsp$

I don't mean any ill content or disrespect to anyone whose OPINION differs from mine. I have personally beaten stronger and faster teams and THOSE don't impress me as much as COACHING i.e. execution, playcalling, time management, etc. After all this IS football. Throw on some cleats and let's get ta crack-a-lackin'!!! thmbsp$ thmbsp$ thmbsp$

Hmm... I haven't tried anything stronger than Mountain Dew or Pepsi while I'm tweaking.. Maybe alcohol is the answer.. LOLmgngcrz

I think I'll stick with listening to Saliva or Korn or something in that genre when I'm tweaking.. :D

Shabby J,

I have spent as little as 2 minutes and as much as 2 hours on a single base. If I can't get what I want out of a particular base in 2 hours then it goes into the junk pile.

But you have to understand how I build my teams. I tweak in rounds. The first round of tweaking is to get a playable squad so the time spent is about 10-15 minutes per base. Then after I scrimmage I start the cutting process. I like to run so my first cutting round goes to my star runner and my line. I cut and replace each one as necessary. If my defense performs poorly I will start there, e.g., If my corners can't cover I'll cut them.

I do this process throughout the season by player, I may even add role players as well. As my team gets better and the season gets deeper I spend more and more time on a single base because I am cutting fewer people.

After every game day I have a list of guys who will be cut and given new bases, this is when I may spend up to 2 hours.


DMC

Jimbo, you are such a loose cannon at times dude, I swear.

In my original question I never asked to place an importance on tweaking or coaching ability vs tweaking ability, etc... I asked tweakers to comment on how much time they spend on a particular base.

You are the one who took off on another tangent.

Take It All In
 

Hey Shabby,

Look at all the coaches who answered your thread. They all have given you varied answers. I enjoyed reading them. Relish it. Take it all in.

Maurice

The Electric Coach

I am doing it Maurice, it's all good, I got some excellent replies.

I agree...
 

...with Maurice. I've enjoyed this thread and I hope it continues for a few days. I've also learned from it sooooooo thanks for starting it Shabby J.thmbsp$

Squash It
 

(A) Shabby, in my 1st reply, I never named names and was not speaking (up or down) directly to you. I read that post yesterday too about "if it takes that long to tweak a base...yada, yada, yada." So, I guess I was directing my reply to anyone who cared to read a ranting! :rtfl:

(B) I never pointed to any of my former leaguemates in L.A. or anywhere elseyou saw fit to defend. I likened tweaking to wearing different types of shoes. It would be interesting to see me play with untweaked bases vs. SUPER TWEAKERS wouldn't it? Good. I'll be in town next week. I hope we can hook-up. PM me your numeros!

(C) I NEVER ANSWER QUESTIONS DIRECTLY!!! Don't you know that yet? lffng$

(D) "Loose cannon?" What did I say that was so bad, other than taking 2 days to answer the question? :cool:

I think in 10 minutes or less gets a base to ~90% capability. The candle warmer has given me much more consistency and I highly recommend it. Its trying to squeeze that last little bit out that you can spend endless time trying to achieve! :eek:

I think I see things from both Jimbo and Norberts percpective. Per what Norbert said, you obviously can't compete if you don't got some talent on those bases, but per Jimbos points, there is so much more to the game. Knowing your players, setting the opponent up, speed thinking, passing, making in game adjustments, being able to play multiple styles, etc.

We're good, no problems Jimbo, thanks for the reply, I guess I forgot who I was talking to.....:rtfl:

I am all for reading a ranting and if I can help set it off, even better! lffng$

Now, on to more pressing matters, lets keep the replies coming in, as some coaches are finding it to be beneficial. It's good to know to those starting to tweak how much time the more experienced coaches spend on each base and what their strategy is.

I like team cuts all season long as Dave Campbell mentioned. You keep an eye on your bases during game time and them note who needs to be cut and replaced. A team is ever evolving that way, I like it.

Thanks
 

Thanks, Shabby J! Let's try to hook up this week. I'd like to meet the new blood out in L.A.!!! :cool:

It should only take a few minutes to tweek a base.

Within 10 seconds you should know if you have a good base to work with or not.

how long have I spent tweak 1 base??
 

I think that was the original question....


1 hour on on base is the longest ... it still is deadly today - L.Thomplison on my chargers!!!!

Hey Shabby,

I gotta give credit where credit is due. The "Dave Campbell" way is actually the "Vince Peatros" way. Yep, I got that "build a team strategy" from Him. The dude really has a great MF mind. I remember on a couple of early visits to his house, probably 1999 or 2000, he told me he could spend hours on 1 guy and my original response was that that amount of time spent on one player was crazy...who would have thought that I would have been doing this for the last 8 years:eek:

Anyway, I think Michigan Joe hit it on the head when he said that the first 10 minutes is about 90% capacity and the rest of the time is spent trying to get that last 10% (1 hour & 50 minutes).

As Vince put it way back in the day when I asked how he went about building his teams, his response was "I'm just looking for the next guy to cut!" Every player he had would have been a superstar on my squad and he is still looking to cut!

So that's where my thinking came from. Teams are evolving organisms.

DMC

bases.....
 

dave i have to agree....having learned to tweek bases from vince i learned the same way.... after about 1 minute i know what i got to work with.. after about 10 mins i know if it is a hit or miss. However, that being said, after a game or two i know who is getting cut and redone and that goes on and on and on as i find new ways to do things or better bases to use etc.
I think if you just settle in with what you have then you will never hit your full potential as a coach. the fun for me is not perfection..it is the never ending pursuit of it that drives me forward.

I agree that you can usually tell if a base is worth your time after a few minutes of simple tweaks (I tend to flash the bases with a lighter, then apply pressure to the rear prongs primarily....the amount of pressure and curl depends on whether I want strength or speed and the kind of base). I then attempt to match the base to a player whose pose or center of gravity will work with that base. However, sometimes after that, I can spend up to a half hour making more small tweaks to get the base to go straight, or arc like I want it to. Since I am relatively new to the game....I have made some gems....but also ruined more than my share of bases! I am improving with time. Specialty stuff....like ITZ dials....frankenstein bases....mixing and matching dials and shells....that can add more time to the tweak. However, there is nothing as satisfying as creating a great player/base combo with your own hands!!

Well Said!
 

VERY WELL SAID, FFF!!!

THATS RIGHT
 

I AGREE 100% THAT TWEAKING OF A BASE IS A VERY BIG PORTION OF ,MINIATURE FOOTBALL ,I AM NOT A GREAT TWEAKER OR A GREAT COACH, BUT IF YOU PLAY YOUR MEN STRAIT OUT OF THE PACKAGE , EVEN WITHOUT A GLIMMER OF A TWEAK YOU MIIGHT WIN A FEW ,BUT YOU WILL FAIL THE MAJORITY OF THE TIME EVEN IF YOU ARE A GREAT COACH, IF YOU CANNOT COAX SSPEED OR STRENGTH OUT OF YOR PLAYERS , YOU DONT STAND MUCH OF A CHANCE, ESPECIALLY THESE TIMES WHEN EVERYONE IS USING IT TO UPGRADE THIER TEAM TO NEW LEVELS,FOR EXAMPLE LOOK AT NORBERT REVELS, JIMMY( THE HULK) DAVIS AND DOZENS OF OTHERS , IF THEY DIDNT TWEAK THEY WOULDNT BE WHERE THEY ARE, LIKE I SAID IM NOT CLOSE TO GREATNESS BUT I TRY AND WIN OR LOOSE I HAVE LOADS OF FUN AND THATS WHAT IT IS ALL ABOUT MY FRIENDS . ppls$ ppls$ ppls$ :chr: :chr: :fghttt: ppls$ ppls$

I'm encouraged
 

thmbsp$ The last few times, I spent tweaking about 6 bases over about a half hour. By the end, I had 4-5 out of six taking it to the house from the other endzone. What I don't get is that some were zigzaging and cutting back as they were getting close to the sideline. Don't know what that's all
about, but I'll take it:D

I Love....
 

tweaking,...........it's like I'm getting back at all those years of playing solitaire and with friends when you only had one or two good bases on your team.....

Yep, yep!
 

Ditto! thmbsp$