Spread offense
 

Are there any coaches out there that run the spread offense? If so, how do you run it? Is it similar to the QB option or wishbone? For those of you who run it do you have any pics or video?

Thanks,

DC

I run that offense now. I find it really causes trouble for opposing defenses, just like on a real football field. Here are the elements I consider key to making the offense work:

-have a good running QB and use his mobility often. It is hard for the "D" to target something that is always on the move! My running QB is very fast....just have to make sure he doesn't run backwards!!!

-have at least two WR's that can get open on their own....not needing stacks or such to get open....boat bases, well tweaked TTC's....maybe creative use of weight balancing to cause the WR to veer off but still go forward when hit.

-have a good RB....on a TTC or ITZ dial....that way he is a threat to hit any hole....not tipping your hand like you would with a rookie base being angled to the hole.

-learn how to pass well.....that is my biggest weakness...but I have improved a bunch lately, and Geno's TDQ was a Godsend.

Kool!
 

Do you have any diagrams or pics of the formations you use?

I am putting together plays for the Seawall Brawl that involve the run and shoot formation. As you know that formation is similar to a spread offense. As was mentioned previously I also highly recommend a moblie QB. Make sure you utilize your RB even on pass plays. Looper bases can be effective as well. I will let you know how well my advice works after the Seawall Brawl. I also agree in that Geno H's TDQ made a big difference. If you don't have one that I highly recommend that you place an order. Unfortunately I do not have a video but if you want to talk let me know and we can exchange numbers.

Coach J

Helpful site
 

Thanks coaches. I came across the following site that has quite a few diagrams of the spread offense.

http://www.bign2football.com/xs1.htm

Let me know your thoughts?

Thx,

DC$cch$

Well....I can't say I liked that diagram with the QB all alone in the backfield....I prefer keeping a TE in the equation and a RB in the backfield with the QB, similar to most shotgun formations.

Before you start getting addicted to using real football strategy for the electric football game, let me give you some sage advice that I got from Bill Porche....a real veteran of the game!

Bill saw me trying to set up 3-4 defenses and 4-3 defenses.....and not doing too well with them. Bill often put 10 men or more on the line.....and kicked my butt. Bill told me....design your plays and players based on electric football and use what works. Don't worry about simulating the real thing....that won't necessarily work on an EF board.

So...I began using unorthodox formations....stacking receivers, putting 9 or more me on the defensive line of scrimmage, etc....and wow, it works! I started picking player poses and base combos with EF functionality in mind.

Does that mean I have learned it all? Hell no. Other veterans will still school me, but at least now I can hold my own. Am I a great tweaker? Nope, but I sure am a lot better now than I was a couple years ago....and I am always looking to learn new tricks!

That said, don't think the spread isn't a viable offensive scheme for EF...it is. However, start thinking more along the lines of using the way things actually work on the EF game board and then exploiting/using your knowledge of those tabletop physics! Here are the kind of questions to be asking....What happens when bases hit each other? Do they veer off? Do they turn away or bounce? Why? How can I use this to my advantage?? How does all that change if the weight balance of the figure is changed? Why does jacking up a base in the rear seem to provide strength/leverage?

FFF- I disagree! Strategy on the electric gridiron mimics real foot in the sense that formations and audibles are about keeping the other team off balance, which is the key to outperforming an opponent with even "talent" on the field. I think that there is a misunderstanding about "real" formations in that the 4-3 rarely looks like the basic 4-3 setup and rather has many turns and twists, such as bringing OLBs up or dropping them back into coverage etc. This is what we do in MF too so I think there are more parallels between real and MF strategy than what you implied.

In MF, if you can run the spread offense and get the defense to spread out and play a 10 man line then I think you have accomplished something with your formation since a 10 man line is extremely vulnerable on any big board and you can make big plays against it. A defense certainly can't play that defense every play or you will get beat hands down, now is there a situation that calls for this defensive formation- absolutely yes (3rd and short comes to mind). Strategy, whether in real football or MF simulation is about tricking the opponent to create the best opportunity for success. Strategy is about trying to create mismatches or opportunities for plays that the opponent "can't see coming". The spread offense is awsome in MF, and I would recommend the lateral moving O-line for this formation to create that seam for an RB or the running QB to take it the distance. The spread offense also makes it hard to double team a talented WR who has the potential to consistently beat one on one coverage.

Joe

More great input...
 

...from you guys. Do any of you have pics of your teams in a spread offense? Joe, can you speak more to lateral moving o-lines? Are you speaking of putting them on bases with itz dials or just using pivots or different angles?

Would also like more input from other coaches.$cch$

Well Joe, you can rationalize it all you want....but people don't run their EF teams much like NFL teams at all. Those 10 man front lines aren't some sort of rarity....they are common. Why? Because those loopers are gonna' get you. Sure...it should make the "D" vulnerable....and for the truly gifted coaches (with well built teams) it does. But, on average, those 10 man and 9 man fronts do just fine. Zone coverage is not the norm in EF, but it is very common in the NFL. Most folks simply jam or turn the EF receivers at the line of scrimmage and that gives them the few seconds they need for their looper to get in and sack or at least rush the QB. I guess you could have rules that prevent jamming the WR...but that doesn't seem to be a good fix. A good coach, with a well tweaked squad can beat press coverage....but it isn't easy if the other coach knows his stuff. Come on....don't tell me EF is just like the NFL...it ain't. Figures with arms that hook or hinder a player simply by physical design are truly unlike the NFL. Sure, you can rationalize it and say it is like "holding"....but isn't that a penalty in the NFL? EF is quite simply EF. Once you start to look at it like a game and get over the hang ups of trying to make it work like the NFL, it makes the EF game easier. I know others will have different opinions, but Bill Porche opened my eyes to the reality and once I started to embrace that concept my game improved by quantum leaps!

By the way, I agree with you about creating linemen who move well laterally...but this tends to require ITZ dials to work well....and my experience is that ITZ dials don't create great strength. So...it will likely require a good plan to use the ITZ linemen to use their lateral movement more like a trap block. Not so much to push, but just to buy a split second. I think Reggie Rutledge would be the expert on this stuff. Maybe slide a tackle out to hit a looper, use the FB to seal the inside and then run in the hole where the tackle was? Timing would be everything here....The FB would need to be speedy and strong....the RB somewhat slower to give time for the blocks to get set. Pursuit from a backside looper would be my biggest fear....maybe run this play to the weak side and get the extra blocking and time to execute using the TE on the back side? I can see this working against those 9 and 10 man fronts. But man....it is all about EF physics more than emulating a real NFL play.

well said
 

very nicely putthmbsp$ thmbsp$

FFF- I totally understand what you are saying about the uniqueness of EF and I agree to many of those points. However, I feel that there are strategic coaching decisons in EF that have many similarities to real football. I don't mean to imply the strategies are the EXACT same, however, the rule set has a lot to do with it the closeness of the strategy to real life football.

Even your so called 9 and 10 men lines are simply man-man corners and safety blitzes which is not to say that those aren't similar to "real" football formations. EF has many similar type of strategic desicions as real football such as whether to play two deep safety, blitz OLBs from outside or play more balanced (stacked 4-3) to stop the run. You just make it sound like there is no correlations betwen X's and O's strategy in EF and real football and I simply think there is correlation. Even with the stacked recievers, the execution of the stacked recievers mimics criss crossing patterns etc.

No big deal, I think we would just be arguing semantics to take this any further. I'm just trying to express that there are key strategic moves involved in EF (as there are in real football), its not just about lining up and pressing go and hoping the best man wins.

Joe

Ok guys...
 

...I respect your opinions and passion for the game BUT let's keep to the topic, your input on the spread offense. ppls$ Does ANYONE out there have pics or video of their particular alignment of this offense? (Where is Jimbo when you need him?):rtfl:

DC

Actually Joe, I tend to agree with you...we are probably more arguing over semantics than anything else. I just find myself spending a lot of time dealing with the EF physics these days....and that seems to really up my game. Coaching is important too, but I just think you have to have the best raw materials available before you can make a top notch product!

Detroit,

Try looking at the earlier post in this forum section on the 4 wide 1 back formation. It might not be what you or others would call a "spread" offense, but it is sure what I am referring to. That series of posts has some pics. If you are not going to stack some of the WR's, I heartily endorse using boat bases or any other base combo you can come up with that can regularly beat press coverage. If you don't have that, your WR's will simply be blasted back or held at the line and make the formation pretty ******** worthless.

To the FrustratedFinFan, I use a 4-3 d and it works fine for me and I have beaten people who put 9 or 10 guys on the LOS, here's what I do, my OT's block outside looper's, my OT's are put on ttc bases that make small tight loops and I don't use ITZ dials, what you have to do is find two strong ttc bases that makes small loops one for the left side and one that loops right it would be good if the bases have some speed, I have found they do stop the outside blitz, just like in the NFL, the OT's job is to stop the outside blitz.
Now, if you are planing to do the spread offense you will need this type of OT's I was taking about and if on the right base, they won't run into your WR's but take out the looper's, that's just my two cent ftbll$

see the 4-wide formation
 

check out the thread and see the formation and tell me what you thinkthmbsp$ thmbsp$

Been On Vacation...
 

...but I'm baaaaaaaaaaacccccccccckkkkkkkkk!!! :rtfl:

To Mr. FFF:

I just played Mr. Porche and 3 other cats out there and used REAL-LIFE Xs and Os. Ask any of 'em and they'll tell ya that going thru that 9-man and 10-man crap was like a blowtorch thru melted butter for me!!! Different strokes for different Coasts!!! They all had to layer their Defenses or they were toast. I'm NOT saying I beat everyone, NOR AM I SAYING they are lesser Coaches. I love them guys like family!!! I'm just speaking to the FACT that I was handing out Xs and Os like they were candy on Halloween!!! :rtfl: :rtfl: :rtfl:

DC: Here's a modified Spread that I used. Despite the fact that the D gave me 1 on 1 coverage on all 3 WRs "spread" right, he knew I was a "Run First Offense" and stayed home against me. I called "Spread Right 24 Submarine" on this play. Why "Submarine?" Because all I did was "DIVE, DIVE, DIVE!!!" BIG TEN BABY!!!! :rtfl: lffng$ thmbsp$

Another Spread Of Sorts
 

Here's another example of a "spread." As in the Defense "spread" so far they forgot to cover the Quick Pitch!?! :eek: i had to "hut" my man BP 'cause he scored on me so efficiently on his 1st drive, I was playing catch up.

1. His 1st drive was PERFECT: 8 of 8 passing for 80yds!!! :eek: :confused: :mad:
2. TD TARHEELS!!!
3. Double coverage on my WRs...PITCH LEFT!!!
4. TD ILLINOIS!!!

Interesting stuff!
 

Thank you coaches for your input.thmbsp$

To FFF - Thanks for pointing out the important ingredients for the spread.

To both Joe and FFF - Thanks for balancing out the realism in using this type of offense.

Andre/K-Lo - After playing around with the different formations, including the 4 wide 1 back I can see the weaknesses/strengths of the spread. Andre, you were on point with some of your comments, especially o-line play.

Coach J - Keep us updated on your success in using the spread at the brawl.


DON'T STOP NOW GUYS...LET'S CONTINUE THIS CONVERSATION. Anybody out there claiming they can shut down the spread on a consistent basis?
DC$cch$

I have been working on how to beat the spread Detroit. I will give you a clue....just look at last year's Super Bowl video and the Giants will show you how to do it. Now the problem is...convert that strategy to the EF game....where the interior line is often just too strong to break, so we opt for loopers instead!

It's funny you mention that FFF. While playing around with it the last few days the one glaring weakness is dealing with loopers (in fact, for me that is a glaring weakness no matter what offense I run). I'm working on ways to counter loopers from the spread. I've come across one or two things but I gotta work out the kinks.

Anyone else?

Beat The Blitz
 

I'm not gonna spell it out, but I bet you beat the blitzing "loopers" the same way in MF as in REAL life football. :cool: Anyone know the answer? Then after that, once the heat is off, you go back to your Base. Then a Combo. Then back to Base. Then to something else until the D adjusts and counters. Ebb and flow. Chess match. Just like REAL life football. ;)

I guess now one knew...or they didn't want to spill the beans on their strategy.:confused:

2 Ways
 

1. Screen to the Flats - RBs are essentially "loopers" on Offense. Send them out to the sidelines, hit a few passes for big gains and the heat should slow down to cover those areas. Then you run up the gut!!!

2. Double TEs spread the loopers out wider than they want to be. Now you can run at one of the loopers with a lead-blocker and see how weak loopers are when they have to take on a FB!!! Or run an "ACE" package which is 2 TEs, 2 WRs and a single RB in the backfield.

A "SPread" Offense is supposed to spread the Defense thin. If a Coach is one-sided in their attack (run only or pass only) then the D has it easy. Balance the attack and the D goes into panic mode. Excel at both Run and Pass - FORGET ABOUT IT!!! thmbsp$

secerts reveiled
 

Now eveyone knows

U Can See My Hand, But You Can't Play My Cards!
 

Just like Spades, you gotta play the right cards at the right time or else! thmbsp$

I bet you're still holding out Jimbo. :D That's ok...I'm a fast learner bro.

I Could...
 

...tell ALL 3 of my secrets and it still wouldn't help. My guys would still do what they wanna do. THEY'RE ALIVE!!! :rtfl:

FFF, though I don't totally agree with your point about using actual football D/O schemes I am beginning to see the light on your comment about the "physics" of the game. I'm now getting more involved in learning that aspect of the hobby. VERY important indeed!

The Spread Offense
 

Detroitchild,

I run what is called "The West Coast Offense" in the DFW. Not many will even attempt these schemes because most MF'ers are as scared of wild splits as they are passionate thinking strength is all you need.

It is such an effective scheme that I run this system about 80% of the time in the DFW. It allows for "gashing" running lanes and deep balls. If I am on my game and executing to precision, it is virtually impossible to stop.

The key to this scheme is the ability to pass with great accuracy and the cerebral part of developing the correct line hole. It's takes much practice and chemistry to do this. When it is done to perfection, it becomes like a symphony orchestra.

I do design plays and run based on those plays. It is highly possible to get what you want out of a play. We (MF'ers) tend to think every play should go for a touchdown or positive yardage. We junk the play if it does not work and tell ourselves "Let's just do the usual run the ball up the middle" or "quarterback sneak".

If you are coming to the SWB, I will be hanging out in my room alot but you are welcome to join me and some of the guys doin' our thing and I can show you "the physics" that we talk about and how some of my systems work. If you got it figured out alread, no need for wasting your time with my rhetoric.

Reg

Thanks Reg. I feel that I can always learn from anybody involved in this hobby. I won't be able to make it to the SWB this year (though I've got it listed as a must in the future) but I will be picking the brain of you and others about the different styles of play.

Thanks, DC

PS - It will never be a waste of time talking to you.thmbsp$

FFF,
I play in the DFW league and would love to run my offense against a 10 man front on defense. I agree totally with Michigan Joe, it would make you extremely vunderable to big plays. A well balanced defense is a much better approach IMO. As far as going up against the "Spread" or the "West Coast Offense" I attack it with speed, so your linemen and LB's can hit those gaps and try to disrupt the play before it gets started. Let me emphasize something here, I'm not sure the kind of league your in or the coaches skills in your league, but I know for a fact that if you bring 10 men fronts to the DFW league your going to be in for a long, long day. Just my 2 cents worth

RD "RaiderNation" aka "Cuban Assasin"

Question @ Jimbo/Michigan Joe
 

Do you guys think that the offensive schemes discussed here can work in the GLEFL. I ask you becaue you've either participated in or seen their style of play.

Any other GLEFL coaches feel free to chime in.$cch$

Anything Works
 

...IF YOU BELIEVE IT WILL AND PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE!

My Playbook has over 250 Offensive plays in it - every set, formation and personnel imaginable. But they don't all translate to every ruleset we play under. Some do in the GLEFL, others do in the LAEFL, and others elsewhere.

Good point Jimbo""Practice Practice"

How do I defend the spread/west coast offense? By shooting quick fast DL thru the gaps, they will disrupt the flow, put them on boat bases, and watch them create "Havoc"

Oh yeah!
 

Boat bases huh! What if you were not allowed to use 'em? What strategy would you use then?

Pro-Line Fast Rounded Fronts

OK!

Too Bad They're Scared Of Those Too!!!
 

Yep, majority voters are afraid of those bases too! :eek: :confused: :mad: :cool: