EF Trivia: Why is it easier for a Coach to credit your bases...how much they think..
 

you $$$$$spent on them...and it is all good(thmbsp$ ) to even credit the tweakers Much respect to you all(Master Tweakers) thanks for elevating all of our gamesppls$ ppls$ ppls$ ppls$ .....but they never seem to credit the Coaching staff:confused: even if some of your talent is straight from your training camp? :dohdh: WHY?

Credit
 

My thought is that unless you are playing straight "bully ball" with the FB and QB surrounding the RB and going for a straight "scrum run" (very un-innovative) and depending on the strength of your bases alone, you are definitely doing some serious coaching in this game.

I've only faced 2 opponents that have done that successfully...both were stronger than me and both won. I give them credit as the strategy worked...but I view those as having the better tweak job at least on offense. Those coaches, even with those bases, still had to play strong defense.

My team is a mixture of my own stuff and tweakers. I ask that the lineman only be able to hold the point of attack...I'm not looking for something to shove...just to avoid the bully ball game as it bores me. From there I love to coach against anyone...let the strategy begin.

There are many guys in this hobby who have the top of the line bases but still aren't taking home every piece of hardware. There definitely is a strong element of coaching that takes place in every game and hopefully credit will be given where credit is due.

What if you Coach your Squad but you have not "put in the years" some Coaches believe
 

you must have in order to even "compete" on their level? What if you run and pass but will use the run if you can....keep in mind inorder to get a win you MUST play "DEFENSE"....so the power "bullie" theory will not work if you play a passer with fast wr's? You keep the game close and you win mor often that losing...perhaps because of skill level maturity? Just kicking it ot there had a conversation with a Coach at The "Bash" on this topic...it is not personal...just to stimulate thought.thmbsp$ thmbsp$

here is a thought...
 

to answer the question..... it's bases that drive this hobby on the field!

If you tweaked up the base right in front of someone, they will still be skepical even though they saw you do it from start to finish!

As for getting coaches' credit for a good gameplan etc - you have to do more than just "pound" the rock or "pluck birds out the sky" to gain reconition for your coaching prowess.....

if you are a running team but use your QB as a lead blocker and/or main ball carrier then you would get a lesser grade than a coach who is a runner that does not use the QB at all in the running game.......

just the nature of the beast:rnt; :rnt; :rnt;

there are other examples, but you get my point.......

Good topic
 

It's interesting. I'm not picking on Norbert here because I think he's an excellent coach and great tweaker.

I've played him 3 times and each time I would dare say that he's had the stronger team. Each time I've come out on top, yet when people talk about top coaches in the hobby, seldom is my name mentioned. This hobby is based somewhat on big tournament results (of which I only have a Bash title but have made 4 finals and countless other semifinals but have a winning or 500 record against Chalmers, Pratt, Raiderman, etc) and tweaking reputation.

In our games, I don't think Norbert would say I'm being arrogant when I say that he and I coached at a similar level. I don't think he'd say it was all luck or anything as I don't remember a kickoff return TD or anything in our games. He's an excellent coach and has the hardware to prove it but I also think I'm being honest, not cocky, when I say that I believe I can go toe to toe with him.

Did I have bases that were good enough to compete with him...sure. Some were even his (and many were mine). But when I later played Adrian in the semi-finals, one of his first comments to me was, "How the heck did you beat Norb with no strength?"

The topic strikes a nerve with me as I've heard the whispers because the bases on my squad are not 100% mine...but then I try to go back to the quote of Teddy Roosevelt where he gives credit to the guys that are in there coaching it up, tournament after tournament like yourself Karim and many other worthy guys:

It is not the critic who counts, nor the man who points how the strong man stumbled or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly...who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, and spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at best, knows the triumph of high achievement; and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.

Coach K Lo, Coach Tom....pure EF wisdom..
 

Thanks for shedding light on this and please keep it commingthmbsp$ thmbsp$ thmbsp$ thmbsp$ thmbsp$

Tom,
I have never heard you mention the name LANCE WILLIAMS........??????
:D


Geno H

Like in any sport...
 

you can have good or great athletes (bases in mf) but not always use them correctly or to their full potential.

As individuals and coachges we all have good days and bad days and sometimes simply get out thought or out coached.

It can be the smallest of margins sometimes.

My lacrosse team just lost a game reently that I still cannot get out of my mind - did me and my staff not prepare them properly? Were we not on our A game coaching wise on that game day? If you care you will always be learning from each experience.

In the many games of sports and MF that I have coached I truly believe the outcome has been a product of all the moving parts - and don't forget the playing conditions (game board) as well.

As coaches we should never forget to congratulate our fellow coach on the other side of the board - he is the one setting them up, making adjustments, etc...regardless of who tweaked what.

Smilin
 

For years now I have allways said coaches have to coach the bases they buy from trainers, which is true, but for years some have PMed me saying please don't put the N on the back of the base, Tom you yourself have done this, some would also say please don't post my name when my order goes out, this is still confusing to me, Coaching is the main thing, so why does it matter if theres a big N on the back.

Beating me will not put your name at the top, YOU have got to do ALOT more for that, theres much more in determining who is a top coach,..........1. strong league play (I play in 2) for the last 5 years, 2. tournament wins, I won 4 championships in 4 different styles,...............theres much more to saying whos a top coach then beating me (smile).

I'm not being arrogant or cocky myself, I'm being honest, **OVERALL** you have a ways to go my friend before you can make statements like, toe to toe,....or same level, that is my honest opinion.

"How the heck did you beat Norb with no strength?" ............Due to board speeds and dead spots, I no longer build my teams OL and DL with power, I use ironmanbases which are strong and move better then the powerbases but not as strong, example is this years miggle team, all ironmanbases and speed, I made it to the superbowl and lost to Jim.

Norbert Revels

Good stuff
 

It's all good, Norbert. You have your opinion and facts to back it up. I've said that you've definitely got hardware and coaching skills and it wasn't meant at all as a slam to you...it's just one way of objectively measuring where a coach is. That is why I liked the tournament rankings point system where you and I both finished tied for #2 in 2005 (or 2006...can't remember). It was objective with pre-defined points based on # of entries and nobody could argue.

To clarify, I don't ever recall asking anyone not to mark their bases nor have I ever asked anyone not to post about my using their bases. I have always been open that my team is a mixture of my own tweaked bases, your bases, Raiderman bases, a Pratt base, and a Jimmy D base. The reason I take off the N is not to hide anything...anyone who knows me knows I'm anal about the look of a team and I put a shoulder number on the back of a base for the purposes of a consistent look and ease of switching bases between players.

As for where someone ranks? Tournament titles do play a role and in that respect, Adrian Baxter has been my downfall (but I'm not alone there). I agree that strong league play is a factor and I wish we had the type of league you have in Detroit. You guys are to be commended. At the same time, when I look at my 5-0 record versus Great Lakes coaches, that can't be discounted either as considering me a formidable foe. I'm 4-2 versus Big Keith, 1-0 versus Pratt, 1-1 versus Raiderman.

When I go into a tournament match against any of these coaches, I do feel as if I have the skill to go toe-to-toe. You may not agree. I'm sure 14 times in the games above players probably felt differently...and 11 times they were wrong.

I know you titled it "smilin" and I enjoy the banter and stirring the pot. I do have a chip on my shoulder as I've felt as if I've paid my dues and don't get the mention...but nevertheless everyone is entitled to their opinion and in no way am I diminishing your accomplishments.