Greatest quarterback 's question

[eflfanatic]

Post 80's

Joe Montana
Troy Aikman
Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
John Elway

Pre 80's

Johnny Unitas
Bart Starr
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Namath
Roger Staubach

[the french guy]

If you will allow me to digress for a moment, the rules have changed to protect the QB of today because the speed and the violence of the game has increased.

In football, do you have some statistics about the evolution of total weight of a squad, for example ?

In rugby, I saw same stats like that that my brother gave (my brother is a rugby coach, for the children teams) to me. From the late 70's to the late 90's the weight and size of the athletes dramaticaly increased. I'll search for the correct stats. It explains why most of rugbymen today wear soft body armors et soft helmets on linemen positions, for example. More speed, more violence...because of the physical evolution of the professional athletes. They are as bad as yesterday, just bigger...so it hurts more

[artlax]

because each persons interpretation of better is relative and often heavily influenced by their age and level of knowledge of the game. Also, as you know the eras are very different - number of teams, number of games, size and speed, advances in physical training and commitment to such, technology, etc...

In the NFL some guys (like Marino) put up great stats BUT never led their team to SB wins while others did not put up the stats and got the SB wins (Terry Bradshaw). And look at Tarkenton and Jim Kelly - all those SB appearances and zero wins.

One interesting stat - on Monday night Tom Brady became the fastest QB to get to 100 wins in the SB era.

[Sparticus]

Concerning headsets (deviating the topic). I've often wondered if a coach from the above booth could just instruct the QB where to throw the ball. What are the rules for head sets and how do we know when they are being used? I do not like them. NFL is being turned into a video game.

[Electric Coach]

During the 70's and early 80's, linemen on both sides of the ball weighed between 260 and 280 lbs. Moreover, they were slower. Today these linemen weigh in at 295, 320 to 340 lbs. Some of them can be as heavy as 360 lbs. Unlike linemen of the past, these linemen are more muscular and faster.

Mass multiplied with velocity equals force. Lighter slower players hit hard, but not as hard as heavier, faster players. This is why the rules of the 70's can't be used in today's game. Imagine a DE such as Dwight Freeney today allowed to hit a QB like Joe Greene did in his prime. Tom Brady's career wouldn't last very long.

Maurice

The Electric Coach

[kotixblack]

Are you aware that in the 60's 70's & early 80's...they put weight limits on the positions like O/D Line. It common for players to be fined for being over weight. As late as the 80's...players did not have the work out regiment that they have today. Physical conditioning, & weight lifting became a major part of the NFL in the late 80's, and early 90's. I don't think that you can take anything away from Deacon Jones, Joe Greene, Fred Dean, Reggie White, and others because they were a little lighter. I think that if they played in this era...they would still be dominant, and in the Hall of Fame. Imagine if they lifted weights, had the technology available, and took the supplements that players take today...how dominant would they be. They say bigger faster, and stronger (players of today). Bigger - they are allowed to weigh more, and are better conditioned athletes today. Faster - Timing technology has improoved...remember Darryl Green, Deon Sanders, Cliff Branch, & Tony Dorsette...just to name a few. Were they slow? Stronger - Yes, todays athlete are stronger. They lift more weights. What about the heart factor? If you go by that bigger, faster, & stronger stuff...there would be no room for the Walter Paytons, Barry Sanders, Emmit Smith, & Jerry Rices' of the world. None of them fall under the catagory of bigger, faster, and stronger. I will give you a side by side comparison, and you tell me. Walter Payton -V- Larry Johnson, Barry Sanders -V- Brando Jacobs, Jerry Rice -V- Vincent Jackson, Emmit Smith -V- Rashard Mendenhall. I once went to a NFL try out...and the selection of the lower teer players came down to how high they could jump, how tall they were, how much they weighed, in comparison to how fast their 40 time was, and how many reps they could do of 200lbs. They didn't take in to account the players hitting ability, football smarts, heart, or ability on the field. It came down to the numbers. If you have a WR who is 6'4" benches 200lbs. 20 times, and runs a 4.0 fourty...he gets the job over Jerry Rice (before the HOF Stats).

[jeff]

Most players had to have an off season job before the 80's , they did not have the time to have off season conditioning programs nor did they have the $$$$ to hire personal chefs, trainers, nutritionists , etc.

The older players seemed to be meaner , it was not as much of a business as it was personal.

[Electric Coach]

Kotix,

I think you misunderstood where I am coming from. I am not talking a players heart or ability because players of both eras possessed those qualities. I am talking about the physics of the game.

Defensive players such as Deacon Jones and Joe Greene were ferocious on the football field. What makes them different from today's defensive linemen is their size and speed. Those two factors have an impact on the amount of force that goes into their hits.

Deacon Jones used to hit QBs in the head and then pile drive them into the turf. The QB would get up with a daze. If you put Deacon Jones in this era, he first would weigh close to 300 lbs. not 260 lbs, which he was in the 60's. He would be faster. Now take those modern attributes that I just described and allow him to assault a QB today the same way he did in the 60's. That QB won't get up because there may be some internal bleeding going inside his head.

Maurice

The Electric Coach

[kotixblack]

K. Got it! I still think that QB's today have it easy compared to those of the past. I really think the problem is that there are so few good QB's...they have to put a skirt on the ones who can actually play, or we would have a league full of TJ O'Sullivans due to injuries. I guess I can see your point. I just think the owners are protecting their investments so that their product can remain tops. Who wants to watch the likes of Babe Lauftonberg, Mike Tomsczak, Jamarcus Russell, TJ O'Sullivan etc; Once again...I got your point...PHYSICS!

[styx]

qb's back in the day did'nt make a whole lot of $$$$,the first i think was joe willie,i think he made a whopping 400 grand ,but that was after he lead the jets to the superbowl.