Miggle 2009 Convention rules are up

[Shabby J]

Originally Posted by nodave@mac.com

I am never one to shoot down anyone's opinion. This certainly is not the forum for that, and that was never my intention.

I was simply commenting that the language you used in a previous post seemed pretty emotional, and I seem to be misunderstanding the "Unity" thing. Maybe I'm out of line. If that's the case, my bad.

I'm just new to the MFCA, and just trying to offer clarifications to previous questions mentioned in this thread.

It's all good, no worries. I am a big promoter of this hobby and the fellowship, unity and integrity that go with it, however, I will not let that stop me from voicing my opinion. I become increasingly frustrated with Miggle from time to time and their failure to listen to us, as well as what happened in the past with their chat forum rules and their not giving the MFCA a chance to help form a more unified MF front.

Being a stubborn Italian I have problems letting some things go.

They are at least working on the quality issues of the Prolines rookies, I will give them that.

I welcome the feedback on any of my posts, I have toned it down since I became a regional rep and am trying to focus on positive MF in the Pacific West. If you are ever out this way look us up.

[broncoman]

that is why it is important get the GREEN ROOM RUMBLE back on track.
but about all, it is all about fellowshipping with coaches across the land, along with the fun of it all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


BRONCOMAN

[sweetka]

I try to stay out of this but I just recently joined convinced that this board was past all of this. Since I have some Italian friends I am thoroughly convinced that Shabby meant no harm. Let's just be mindful that there is always those who may take statements out of context beyond someone's own penchant for stating the obvious and moving on.

The championship is mines this year. I am commiting myself this year as a player. No half azzin'. No announcing. Dave, get the Mike for me because what you will witness this year at Miggle and any event I am in this year will be Ken, the dedicated player. Sure, I come with a ton of athletes but this year I am bringing a team, not some rigged up deal done three days before the convention. Not an excuse, and it is a challenge to all that attend. I can laugh at myself so if it comes back to bite me I'll roll with it!

I will start by reclaiming the Championship in the Great Lakes , yeah I said it , then moving on from there. Thanks for the updated info guys!

Sha!

[nodave@mac.com]

I only wanted to be proactive and begin putting out information, which is why I started this thread. I felt obliged to come to Miggle's defense because there are people who read these threads who do not know about the Miggle convention. I didn't want people only getting one side of the story.

I am in leadership capacities with non-MF organizations, and many times the tone and language of a leader can influence the decisions and actions of others, whether wanted or unwanted. There are hundreds of members on this board, and thousands more who simply read through while visiting.

Thanks for the invite, Shabby J. I'd love to get out there.

Sweetka, I hope you bring the pain. I'd love to shake your hand at the end of it.

[Shabby J]

It's all good, there was no bad intent by any party, we are just discussing things, we all understand where the other is coming from and what they meant.

As Broncoman said, in the end it's about getting together and playing some MF, words I need to remember myself.


Good post Sweetka and good luck on reclaiming the championship!

[mklingbeil]

Dave,
I meant no disrespect. It is great you put the rules out early (first time I believe) and with a quick glance, they look pretty consistant and well thought out.

My problem is with the equipment, first in a specific sense, then in a more macro-sense. Specifically, hardly any of the convention bases are first-runs. Certainly the Patriotic bases are in their second run, and they are no where near as good. However, Miggle has not banned the old patriotic blue TTC bases. So why ban the first-run Prolines?

The answer I gather is to let new people compete on an even keel. That is silly since any newbie who plays will simply get crushed on the field. Tell me someone who plays the game for the first time can match-up against Norbert, Jim D, Mike P, Raiderman, Adrian B, Big Keith, Don S, Ron B, Jimbo, Mike T, or any of the other fine coaches who will attend. That view demeans the ability of these coaches. Newbies should have their own catagory, one where they actually have a chance.

What this ruling does do is make the game look like what people have preconceived...a bunch of players who do not perform at the highest level. The game is best when players can use their best bases...which leads me to the Macro part. Miggle should not worry so much about competitor bases, custom figures, and other stuff. The proline bases are the best bases made. They make most other bases look like entry-level products. So why not welcome the opportunity to show this? My guess is, even if they allowed other bases, on a team of 35 there might be 1 or 2 other bases on a team anyways. I admit I like another producer's rookie bases for my RBs because they are really good at that. Dials would open up the play, but most people recognize they will not get the strength that Proline bases acquire with good tweaking. Miggle has nothing to lose, they would show that their bases are superior while improving the look of the game on the field...right?

Plus, part of the game is the aesthetic beauty, the fields, painting, and custom figures. This is something that cannot be matched by the new Madden game. Allowing custom figures makes the game look better. Other tourneys have allowed this and have had little to no problems.

If the goal of this weekend for Miggle is positive media attention, which is the goal for this organization as well, than allowing the action on the field to be better by allowing each coach to bring his best bases and best-looking figures is in Miggle's self-interest. Think about it...the media will have no idea what is Miggle's product and what is someone else's, all they will know is the game looks and plays good!

That is just my thinking, please do not take offense Dave. I know this is not your decision (it comes from above) and I respect the job you are doing on behalf of the EF community.

Thanks,
Mark

[sweetka]

James Crews, Norbert Revels, David (Daniels), all won on their first or second attempts using this format. Many coaches who have stellar reputations, that you mentioned above, have never won Miggle. Some have won other tourneys, in other formats, but not Miggle. Therefore, I feel Miggle is the ultimate tourney, with the most coaches, and highest level of difficulty. A coach like Ron Bell, can take a speedy team and win more than anyone. A coach like Norbert can use power to win the tourney. Keith Chalmers with excellent defense, Greg Hardmon won throwing over everybody, Yourself and Bill won by combining your individual strengths, David Daniels won like Greg did, and so on. It's about getting hot, then staying hot. No different than the NCAA, or even a Gus Macker. Not equipment. In fact, one could say that many other tournaments cater to certain rule sets of their local leagues thus creating local repeat champions. Is that really progress? I don't think so.

The Proline issue seems simple to me. They no longer produce the product type. People kill me with this first run, second run garbage. The specs are the same save for slight variations in the materials used. The only real difference between first and second run is the first runs are hot off the presses and the second runs have been stored. Any good tweaker worth their flatnoses can make either base function equally. Every year guys come from the Convention talking about "These are first runs", then rush to tweak the base to prove they are better than what they have. It's a placebo. If you tweak a base great today it will be better than a base you tweak a month ago because the older base has already settled and the newer base has not. Check back in three days and see what happens to your new tweak. That's why people "Re-Tweak".

It is not fair for me or any other coach to be able to go in their basement, pull out a base that has more weight at the lower end, is thinner in width and rounder, yet unattainable for the opponent trying to deal with the inequity. Our rules state in our league "mass produced". That type of Proline is no longer "Mass Produced" therefore not attainable for any coach. I recently dealt with this matter with several coaches who created a decided advantage in their leagues, and in my estimation, an unfair advantage by not only using the base type, but altering it even further. I was tweaking them but as any Trekki would tell you sometimes you don't violate the "Prime Directive". We surely don't need that at any tournament.

I love this chatboard, especially it's intent. Let's just act like Miggle is any other tournament like the Seawall Brawl, Buzzfest, and any others that I have not mentioned that deserve it by accepting it for what it is, enjoy the fellowship opportunity which is foremost, then play with a diverse, non opinionated, enthusiasm!

Thanks for your time!

[Raven maniac]

I'm not worried about bases, custom figs....I just want to know which Embassy suites in Chicago. I wasn't there for the first so I don't know where you guys stayed. As far as the other stuff. Just have the GRR. Dave which Embassy suites.

Darrian

[mklingbeil]

Sweetka,
I was referring to a newbie, not someone who has never played in the tournament. Sure Greg and Norbert won, but they have been playing the game for many years, as has most of the Miggle tourney winners. What I was saying was the tourney is being set up so the person walking in and seeing electric football can compete with guys like Norbert and Greg...and that is just insane. No matter if you allowed the newbie to have MUCH better bases let alone equal than those guys, Norbert and Greg would STILL kill them!

Second, Proline bases are STILL being made. However, as Miggle admits, the new product is nowhere near as good as the first-run...probably because someone who knows what they were doing picked the first-run plastic. My issue is, the first-run of all the convention bases are better than their second runs, yet they are not illegal. Why would you make a superior product, then not allow people to use it in YOUR tournament? If the answer is the new plastic is not as good...Heck make it better! You have six months to get it right, are they afraid they will not get it done even in that amount of time?

The last point is this...all those other tournaments attempt to make the game look as good as possible. They may approach it a different way, with different rules and styles, but they all want the public to see EF in the best possible light. Every tournament has to limit things such as bases and figures, but by limiting the equipment as much as the Miggle tourney, the game does not look as good as it possibly can. Miggle wants two things from these conventions, high attendance and good media coverage. It seems to me these limitations serve only to limit both of these possible outcomes. If you want proof, look at the popularity of this chatboard compared with Miggle's since they limited what you can say on their's.

Fellowship is great, but so is good competition!
Mark

[broncoman]

PRETTYBOY, get the GRR set up back. you heard the man, let's get it on!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MY TURN TO WIN.


BRONCOMAN