standardization in our hobby...

Somewhere between the chicken and the egg, this post lost it's substance.

For Goodness sake, let it go guys...

[Coach Rip]

Way to go Rich! You are always the fly in the toothpase!:p

[RavennaAl]

Getting back to the main jist of this post, I think there are other things more important than having a "standardized" way of playing to get more people interested in EF. Let's look at us for a moment. Collectively, we are a bunch of 40 - 50 somethings playing a game that we were introduced to as children. But why are we still playing? And more importantly, why aren't there more younger guys playing? I think it's no secret that most guys in the 40 -50 age bracket played this game when they were younger, in fact it's hard to find someone who didn't play it. But why are we the only ones who still do? There must have been something special that took place in our collective youth that makes us still want to play.

Fast forward to todays youth. Is it possible to get them as excited as we were/are? They are raised on Nintendo and PlayStation. They use computers all day long. They crave anything that's technologically complex. EF is as technologically advanced as a stone. We're facing an uphill battle.

I think our best bet is college kids. They've been playing Madden games most of their lives. They're a little older and perhaps looking for something that isn't being spoon fed to them. What we need to do is get into the college dorms and get these kids interested. Show them what can be done with the players. If we can give them something that they can hold in their hands, design and manipulate to what they want it to do or be, then maybe we can get more people hooked and playing again. Standardized playing would be nice, but for now, what we need is to get guys out from in front of the TV or PC.

Hopefully I am not out of place, being from OZ.

I think a good model to look at is Subbuteo and FISTF (FEDERATION INTERNATIONAL SPORTS TABLE FOOTBALL) http://fistf.com/. Subbuteo as some of you know is basically table soccer - very popular in the sixties and seventies. It's a game that has been around for a long time and lots of people played it as kids in England and Australia - much like EF.

FISTF has managed to grow the sport internationally by having a standard set of rules which means that people from around the world can go to to a FISTF venue and play – not having to worry about different home rules etc. Is it the only way to play Subbuteo – NO, but if you are playing competitively then it’s the way to go. Does it suit everyone who plays Subbuteo – No, but what does.

Looking at the posts I think that the NHFL provides a basis for a similar organisation. I wish you guys luck.

Hope to get to a Miggle convention one day and meet some of the people who appear to be so passionate about this game.

Here is an example of what having standardised rules can do for a game.

Here is the FISTF list of coming events (note the countries that you can play in)
11. FISTF calendar
Added tournaments: -
18/11/06 - Satellite in Truro, Nova Scotia, Canada ; CM: Gary Caven - gcaven@hotmail.com
18-19/11/06 - FISTF Masters in Malta ; CM: Mario Spiteri - mario.spiteri@fistf.com
18-19/11/06 - IO in Dumfries (SCO) ; CM: Iain Bell - iainbell54@tiscali.co.uk
25-26/11/06 - GP/IO (teams) in Berlin (GER) ; CM: Marcus Tilgner - mtilgner@arcor.de - http://home.arcor.de/mtilgner/intern...l/gp06-inv.htm
02-03/12/06 - IO in Issy-les-Moulineaux (FRA) ; CM: Thomas Ponté - thomalf.roucas@wanadoo.fr
09-10/12/06 - Satellite in Almada (POR) ; CM: Sérgio Ramos - manarssa2@gmail.com - manarssa2@hotmail.com
09-10/12/06 - IO in Buenos Aires (ARG) ; CM: Gregorio Caro SolÃ**s at greg@redsalta.com
17/12/2006 - Satellite in Athens (GRE) ; CM: Christos Archimandritis - info@poep.gr
13-14/01/07 - IO/GP (teams) in Temploux (BEL) ; CM: Benoît Jadot - benoit.jadot@just.fgov.be
20-21/01/07 - GP in Oldham (ENG) ; CM: Alan Collins - alan.collins@fistf.com
20-21/01/07 - Satellite in Roma (ITA) ; CM: Antonello Rodriquez - antonellorodriquez@libero.it (teams on saturday)
27/01/07 - Satellite in Paris (FRA) ; CM: Thomas Ponté - thomalf.roucas@wanadoo.fr
28/01/07 - IO in Paris (FRA) ; CM: Thomas Ponté - thomalf.roucas@wanadoo.fr
03-04/02/07 - IO in Athens (GRE) ; CM: Lazaros Papakonstantinou - papalazaros@yahoo.com
03-04/02/07 GP/IO (teams) in Verviers (BEL) - Benoit Vanwissen - bvanwissen@tiscali.be
10-11/02/07 - Major in Elbeuf (FRA) ; CM: Nicolas Lefebvre - nicolefebvre@free.fr or nicolefebvre@neuf.fr
17-18/02/07 - IO in Knighton (WAL) ; CM: Algy Taylor - algy.taylor@tfhost.com - www.caru.tfhost.com
17/02/07 - IO in Cospicua (MLT) ; CM: Mario Spiteri - mario.spiteri@fistf.com
18/02/07 - GP in Cospicua (MLT) ; CM: Mario Spiteri - mario.spiteri@fistf.com
24-25/02/07 - GP in Odense (DEN) ; CM: Jesper Staal Nielsen - jstaal@goddagnet.dk
03-04/03/07 - Major in Mons (BEL) ; CM: Olivier Père - olivier.pere@skynet.be
10-11/03/07 - Satellite in Foz do Douro (POR) ; CM: Norberto Miguel at ngoncalv@smc.smces.es & João Rodrigues at joaorodrigues.norpecas@oninet.pt
17-18/03/07 - GP & IO + GP for teams in Washington DC(USA) - CM: Zach Walker - ferdy22@gmail.com
17-18/03/07 - IO in Milton Keynes (ENG) ; CM: Jeremy Bradley - Jeremybradley49@yahoo.co.uk - http://www.freewebs.com/tspawhitestar/
24-25/03/07 - GP & IO + GP for teams in Windsor, Ontario (CAN) ; CM:
Wolfgang Haas - haas.wolfgang@gmail.com
24-25/03/07 - IO in Reggio Emilia (ITA) ; CM: Marco Lamberti - marco.lamberti@bancaprofilo.it
31/03&01/04/07 - GP in Amsterdam (NED) ; CM: Robbert Thoen - romithoen@casema.nl
07-08/04/07 - GP in Beausoleil (FRA) ; CM: Alexandre Popoff - alexpp2@wanadoo.fr
14-15/04/07 - IO in Traiskrichen (AUT) - Christian Bluemel - chris23_at@yahoo.com
28-29/04/07 - GP in Hampden Park, Glasgow (SCO) ; CM: Mike Burns - mike@worldtablesoccer.com
12-13/05/07 - GP in Vienne (AUT) ; CM: Markus Jurik - mjurik@chello.at
12-13/05/07 - IO in Almada (POR) ; Sérgio Ramos ; manarssa2@gmail.com - manarssa2@hotmail.com
20/05/07 - Satellite in Athens (GRE) ; CM: Lazaros Papakonstantinou - papalazaros@yahoo.com
26-27/05/07 - Major in Bologna (ITA) ; CM: Riccardo Marinucci - botigers@infinito.it
02-03/06/07 - IO in Murcia (ESP) ; CM: Juan C. Granados - granadosjc@terra.es
09-10/06/07 - GP in Athens (GRE) ; CM: Georgos Dimakeas - georgiosdi@panafonet.gr
23/06/07 - Satellite in Yorkshire (ENG) ; CM: Paul Lawrenson - Paullawrenson177@hotmail.com
30/06&01/07 - GP in Roma (ITA) ; CM: Enrico Guidi - exywj@libero.it
08/07/07 - Satellite in Dolo (ITA) ; CM: Davide Lazzari - davila@shineline.it
14-15/07/07 - IO in London (ENG) ; CM: Les Commons - les.commons@blueyonder.co.uk
21-22/07/07 - Satellites in Templeuve (BEL) ; CM: Vincent Coppenolle at Vincent.coppenolle@assur.cbc.be
21-22/07/07 - GP in Foz do Douro (POR) ; CM: Norberto Miguel at ngoncalv@smc.smces.es & João Rodrigues at joaorodrigues.norpecas@oninet.pt
28-29/07/07 - GP in Corbera de Llobregat (ESP) ; CM: Arturo Martinez - artmartinez@mixmail.com
11-12/08/07 - Major in Mattersburg (AUT) ; CM: Robert Lenz - robert.lenz@gmx.at
19/08/07 - Satellite in Pembroke (MLT) ; Karl Camilleri - makhami@msn.com
31/08-02/09/07 - World Cup in Les Herbiers (FRA) ; CM: Laurent Garnier at cdmfdt2007@atenaconcept.com & Heinz Eder at heinz.eder@fistf.com

[Ray F]

With all of the questions being asked on the miggle board about the convention tournament, it’s obvious our hobby is lacking in standards. Fortunately the NHFL has taken all the guesswork out so that every player knows what he can use for equipment and how to prepare for an NHFL event before he gets there. The NHFL represents our best approach for a national players association so far, the rule-set is fun, well tested, and improved every year. The collection of caretakers in charge have done their homework and spent many personal hours recruiting and perfecting and have not asked for anything in return except for all players to have and promote a good time playing EF.
Thanks NHFL, Ray F

[Geno H]

I have read this thread from the start and have opted not to respond until now.I came into this hobby 11 months ago on Dec. 25th. To start with I have found it VERY easy to have all my questions on any subject pertaining to the hobby answered.If standardization & nationalization is what you want for the hobby then there is only ONE organization that has been presented to me in these 11 months.I myself want this.So what I did is JOINED it. Is it exactly what I want? The answer is NO.But I liken it to people complaining about the Government or politicians and then you ask them DID YOU VOTE? And they respond NO.Where I am heading with this is if you want it to happen then be a part of it and then you have a say in it.I am a part of a National organization now and believe you me I will speak out about the changes that need to be made.I also understand that not all of the changes I want to see will happen,it is a world of compromises.I probably havent stated this as intelligent as some others may be able to but the point is it has to start somewhere and develop.It takes involvement so I repeat HAVE YOU VOTED?

Geno H

[WEIRDWOLF]

I think you stated it very well Geno. Compromise and involvement are the key and the great thing is that at the end of the day after we have played all our NHFL games and completed the season we can still construct rules and play in our own areas in whatever form we want to. Even though the TAEFL is also the Great Plains division in the NHFL we still can have a TAEFL season at some point in the year based on our own ideas but for that one time of year I can show up at the NHFL event and play someone who I have never met and each of us know what is expected with in the rules and among our players. I also want to welcome back our Aussie friend. We missed you over the last few months.

Originally Posted by Geno H

I have read this thread from the start and have opted not to respond until now.I came into this hobby 11 months ago on Dec. 25th. To start with I have found it VERY easy to have all my questions on any subject pertaining to the hobby answered.If standardization & nationalization is what you want for the hobby then there is only ONE organization that has been presented to me in these 11 months.I myself want this.So what I did is JOINED it. Is it exactly what I want? The answer is NO.But I liken it to people complaining about the Government or politicians and then you ask them DID YOU VOTE? And they respond NO.Where I am heading with this is if you want it to happen then be a part of it and then you have a say in it.I am a part of a National organization now and believe you me I will speak out about the changes that need to be made.I also understand that not all of the changes I want to see will happen,it is a world of compromises.I probably havent stated this as intelligent as some others may be able to but the point is it has to start somewhere and develop.It takes involvement so I repeat HAVE YOU VOTED?

Geno H

I agree with you two completely. The fact that we can play under one umbrella of rules for nationwide competition is a thrill. And we could then take those rules, tweak them a little bit for our own league and play thru another season in the spring, and see if our rule changes will work or if they won't.
If they do work, we can submit those findings to the NHFL rules committee. If we find they don't work, we can try something else amongst our own league.
The idea is by submitting any possible rule changes we would have more weight if they've been tried throughout a full season, for research and development purposes.
Car racing sactioning bodies have had this same problem for decades. It's awesome when a guy can pull his car trailer anywhere in the USA and race with a set of rules that everyone else races by.
Join the NHFL and see if the rules are to your liking, they very well might be. But keep an open mind, not every rule will benefit your team, and remember, other coaches teams will face the same obstacles.

[NEW CASTLE HiTMEN]

I wasn't going to reply to this post but I feel I must. This reply is in MY OWN OPINION! It is not a personal attack on ANYBODY . To me the word standardization means status-quo. People who know me know I don't follow that rule. I like what I like. I play solitaire electric football and I also play electric football with my nephews. We use a format that we like. The offensive coach can stop the board at any time and make pivots. The defense can not turn the board off but it can make pivots when the board is off. We do this to keep an 11 and 13 year old interested. However, they are interested with the NHFL. I signed up for a franchise the first year but did not play. I could not play in any following seasons due to personal and job requirements. But now that things are straight and I have more time on my hands we may join the league. And for those that do not know I have become visually impaired. So the Triple Threat QB is a task for me and that is why we use the passing sticks. I still work at my job at the New Castle Police Dept. but had to take a deminishing role. I will still try and master the Triple threat QB and will hopefully join the NHFL one day. But the one thing I do have when playing electric football is FUN! THATS WHAT IT IS ABOUT!