Enough is enough. Let's vote!

[WEIRDWOLF]

I guess I'm trying to figure out what is the objection to having standards?
Ultimately, I think, but I may be wrong on this, we are just trying to set an MFCA standard. I know it is not worded that way in the poll, but isn't that what it ultimately comes down to? Leagues are still going to set whatever weight they want to run with. I don't see a single league changing to 4.0 just because we set a standard so really this is about an MFCA standard.

There is still nothing wrong with having classes. The MFCA skills competition is set to 3.3 and below and the enhanced is everything above 3.3. Does this change with a 4.0 standard? Probably...

I'm just trying to get a grip on what the real question is here? What is the ultimate goal of setting standards and why are so many opposed to ANY standard?

[Coach Rip]

Wolf,

The standard, by definition, is already set.

All the mfca has to do is decide on what classes are going to recognized for whatever competition you have.

Classes of competition are much different than a "standard".

What we have here are some posters with unbridled passion, and unfortunately for them, make no sense because they are misusing words, or using words in the wrong context.

When you buy a car, ............ they have a "standard" version, it is what it comes with from the factory in its basic state.

If you want to order "options", you are basically ordering a "custom" car.

Likewise, when you get a figure from BuzzBall it is "standard", ...............once one removes the arms, and changes them, or bends them, the owner has just technically "customized the figure.

Therefore, by the very nature of these ridicules posts it is impossible to have a 4.0 standard. for a few reasons.

#1 a game piece is made of two parts, a figure and a base. Figures have a weight range but max out at 2.0/2.1. Bases also have weight maxing out at 1.2/1.3.

#2 Figures and bases must be weighed separately. as I stated numerous times a heavy figure on a light base can "make weight", but after the weigh in the heavy figure can make it's way onto a heaver base, therefore being "overweight.

#3 The base line standard has already been set. by 40 years of tudor.

[Geno H]

I personally think that IF the MFCA is truly about the MF coach then they or we should simply IDENTIFY what standards are already out there.

The WEIGHT standards are already there and they have identified theirselves.

3.3 & under- many leagues use this

4.0 & under- many leagues use this

unlimited- very limited use

Yes I agree there are a couple of Leagues out there that use some odd weights I liken that to "house rules" a little of the norm and it is only in a couple of areas.

That is just one area of standards. You have heighth, width so on and so forth.


I think this single question of 3.3 vs 4.0 has handed us confusion and division (in thought). So many people have answered this poll in a different manner and for different reasons. It has yielded as much as the thought that was put into it.

This is a much more important issue than to simply throw up one question and make decision.

For the Coach:
I think we need to simply IDENTIFY the standards and then educate the coach and let him make his own decision which will probably be handled on a local level and take care of itself.

For the Manufacture:
This is where we want to save ourselves from an ARMS RACE. We dont want to let the Standards to steadily increase causing our equipment to become outdated and no longer useable. It will becaome a money pit and ruin the hobby.


Geno H

[Geno H]

Coach Rip,
It seems we were answering at the same time and agree on some things.

I have stated before weighing the Figure and base seperately is a another debate that should be dealt with within a rule set not as part of a standard.


Geno H

[RPD]

I have read some of the responses. I have a very easy solution which I'm implementing. I'm gonna have both a 3.3 and a 4.0 team. But what I can tell you from what I'm seeing with a lot of leagues around the country and coaches as well, you'll be well advised to have a 4.0 team ready as I think this is where the hobby is going! As for a standard for the hobby? I think if you have a 3.3 and 4.0 team ready, you'll be able to play and compete anywhere in the country.

RD

[Coach Rip]

Geno,

As the reasons I have stated, figures and bases are separate, therefore since they both come in slightly different sizes, the "standard" for a figure and base is not a different debate.

There are standard figures from the factory, and there are standard bases from the factory.

[Coach Rip]

Your post is reasonable in thought, as it makes sense, however, if you have played around the country as I have, the 3.3 and so called 4.0 are just window dressing, aka tip of the iceberg....................and no, they are not melting and will drown us in 10 years, ...but that is for another blog!

What I have found through experience, is you will have to modify or build a team for each league you play.

most leagues are Pro nfl type leagues, if you have a raiders team out fitted on both weight classes, ...............suppose the league you want to travel to play, already has a raiders team?

Each league has their "flava" with regards to rules, they may restrict certain figures, they may restrict they way you weight your players, ....... ie. lead tape or boiled bases, weight under the base only or allowed to be on the figure...........

[RavennaAl]

George, I have no personal issues with you. I consider you a friend in this hobby. However; I do have to ask. Who said that bases have to weigh 1.3 grams or less? Who said figures have to max at 2.0 or 2.1? When and where was this ever discussed? You keep refering to the Tudor figures and bases, which is fine. But there are other figures out there that have come and gone and some that are still here. What about them? Why are they being excluded? When these came out, where was the written rule that they should be such and such a weight? I don't recall anyone at anytime ever having a vote to say 2.0 is the maximum weight for a figure and 1.3 shall be the maximm weight for a base and nobody shall be allowed to add weight to them. Exactly who made these rules???????????????

I've always played with 3.3 or less teams. I have absolutely no problem with how they perform. Every team I have is at this weight. BUT, and that's a big but, I have no problem with making a change. Times have changed since the 60's. The game, or should I say the game play has changed since then. The boards have changed since them. Maybe it's time we make a new weight limit, one that is not constricted to figures and bases that were made 40 years ago.

That is what this vote was meant to be. Do we want a new limit of 4.0, something that we can set in writing so that all manufacturers today and tomorrow can adhere to, or do we want to keep the old limit, based on figures and bases from when the game was in its heyday?

I think we need something set in stone, one way or the other, so when we start promoting this wonderful hobby of ours, we don't look like a bunch of schmucks with no rhyme or reason as to how to play the game.

[WEIRDWOLF]

It seems the word "standard" is mudding the conversation.

So what we have then is "Classes":
1)Out of the box, out of the bag, unmodified, unweighted. Under 3.3 (stick a figure on a base-Does that include chinstrap, painting, facemask, towel,grass additions?)
2)Modified, weighted, customized and under 4.0
3)Unlimited, anything goes as long as it is human in proportion.

[Geno H]

Originally Posted by Coach Rip

Geno,

As the reasons I have stated, figures and bases are separate, therefore since they both come in slightly different sizes, the "standard" for a figure and base is not a different debate.

There are standard figures from the factory, and there are standard bases from the factory.

George,
It governs itself. If I use a base @ .95 and a figure @ that weighs 3.05 guess what I can play that in a 4.0 format. However at the same time I cant use it at any lower playing weight.
To set a standard in fear of someone switching bases is the tail waggin the dog.

Geno H