The BIG Question! Take your gloves off and discuss...

[Megawattz]

Originally Posted by Geno H

It seems to me reading through this thread I get the impression we are all in agreement that Tournament participation is down. It also seems to me one party is offering up a solution that directly attacks that problem. ?????? Am I right???? I am trying to get a grasp, as these types of threads actually get painfully redundant in the past. If we can "fuse" together a "PRO CIRCUIT" with existing and WILLING Tournaments across the Nation (regardless of ruleset) it seems that would be some serious motivation to the local grass roots coaches to participate in thier local Tournament. Growth from the bottom up is what we need. Knowing that placing well in your local tournament also could give you a chance to officially quailify for a national playoff will fuel the fire of alot of coaches.

Am I even close to understanding what is being offered???????

Megawatts????????


Geno H

I think if a real effort was made this could be a formula for progress, we must remind ourselves that we cant do it alone, by giving the guys that do the hard work a real stake in something with national implications, that can be measured, with a structure designed to increase cooperation & participation, we may be able to reverse some of the recent trends. I feel Rules should be the domain of the coaches for they are the ones that has to live with whatever is decided, freeing the MFCA from such a devisive issue, will serve to empower the MFCA as they are now truly a neutral party on the rules issue. Each "Region or Tourny" would have a represetative on a rules committee, representing the styles of play for that region. They would draft the rules together, with the MFCA overseeing the process. Those rules are then adopted by the MFCA as the official "PRO LEAGUE RULESET" ratiffied on a yearly bases, allowing for easy review & amendment if needed. At this point rules arent on the table, the cooperation of regions is first on the to do list, Ive contacted various Organizers, with verbal commitments from "MOZEEK THE BAM NY REGION", DEARELL BREVARD BELTSVILLE, "MIKE ROBERTSON SOUTH WEST REGION" "JIM DAVIS GREAT LAKES MID-WEST", this is just a start, I need someone to represent "OPEN RUN WEST COAST", cant reach "DAVE NICKLES BAMA BLAST DEEP SOUTH" any info on how to reach him will be greatly appreciated. These guys were chosen because, they already run a TOURNY or LEAGUE with major support, have an active members list already established, & have displayed dedication essential to success. This in no way is set in stone, only a place to get started. any Major events or areas with significant membership, that may have been overlooked please make yourself known.

[broncoman]

but you have to think back to PHILLY MIGGLE convention when I and other coaches sat down on a FRIDAY night to put together a nation rule set. it worked for MIGGLE, but coaches still did not opt to use these rules in there rules. then came REGGIE'S TEXAS SHOOT-OUT-RULES and most LEAGUES have gone to these rules. I for one have played all the different rules in my travels in tournaments.
KEN, coaches came west to play in CANTON to compete, not because the CBSMF will be in LAS VEGAS next year. love to see you in L.A. next year at the OPEN RUN.



BRONCOMAN

[sweetka]

Originally Posted by broncoman

but you have to think back to PHILLY MIGGLE convention when I and other coaches sat down on a FRIDAY night to put together a nation rule set. it worked for MIGGLE, but coaches still did not opt to use these rules in there rules. then came REGGIE'S TEXAS SHOOT-OUT-RULES and most LEAGUES have gone to these rules. I for one have played all the different rules in my travels in tournaments.
KEN, coaches came west to play in CANTON to compete, not because the CBSMF will be in LAS VEGAS next year. love to see you in L.A. next year at the OPEN RUN.



BRONCOMAN

They put us in a room. My point again is that, and you know me, if the rules are tap on the board with a flashlight I play by them. To date, whenever I have left Michigan I have tried to gain knowledge of why people do things the way that they do. I am diversified enough to move out of my comfort zone. Mike, I stated that the coaches came because of the league, not because it was being hosted in Vegas the following year. I for one was all for that and have stood side by side with the Coast on many an issue. This circuit idea is all good with me and I conveyed that to Bruce when he asked me to look in and post yesterday. To be honest I had been to busy to notice it.

Now, in my original post I addressed FOB, ATT, and passing methods. I chose not to throw rulesets out there because in my reading it seemed the slightest dissent has been met with force.

I stated my opinion and if you disagree fine. It is even okay to have an exclusive circuit for the PROS which I am one.

But since it is a PRO league the tournaments need to be run by real referees as the stakes will be very high. Yet another offering

I will go back to working to get average Joe back into the hobby, not the sport!

I will leave you guys to this hard core, or grass roots portion of the hobby. I will continue toward my goal of getting hobbist involved at a different level. Once the dust is settled, whatever the ruleset, I will play.

Out

[Megawattz]

Here we are in "2010" playing a "Board Game" introduced roughly 60 yrs ago, in an age of high technology. Our membership is dropping, not growing and every year that passes it gets worse, while other hobbies such as ping pong, billiards, fooz ball, RC racing of all types, darts hell even scrabble has an audience & respect on the street, with no changes, Why dont we? with some being in the olympics! we have some of the most creative & innovative members of any hobby, some can even be considered scientist, imagine that!artist is easy for all of us but we hesitate to call ourselves "PROS" as if that was an insult. by creating something real we have a bases from which to call ourselves real pros at what we do and take our place among those hobbies prior mentioned. By forming a "PROFESSIONAL" league we gain credibility with the public, that way when we get the "mic" interviews and such, we have something more than just a "discription" to offer. We can begin to make celebs out of the "GRECOS""NATIONALS"BAXTERS"HULK"ect. because they are viewed as pros. Some of the points raised were directed at the "MARKETING COMMITTEE" image what u can do with the word "PRO". We are the hobby "SPORT" with all the skills of a professional, we can shape it in "OUR" image, as no 1 intity can do it alone!

[FrustratedFinFan]

A "professional" gets paid to play a sport. We are not paid to play this game and I hope that never happens. I don't have much doubt who the best players of the game are...and I don't need consensus on a set of rules to prove that to me. Mike Robertson, Celo and a host of others will win more than they lose, regardless of the rules we choose. I hate the push to a national set of rules, because it causes folks in each region that want to be the champs to push their leagues to adopt those rules. It compromises the integrity of the local events and I think that ends up hurting attendance and enthusiasm.

Why can't we just celebrate what we have? I see nothing wrong with offline MFCA games during a regional tourney...but I wish we could get away from a push to nationalize everything under an umbrella set of rules. Is it really for the love of the game, or is it for egos?? As I said before, I know that if I want to travel to Canton, then I play by their rules. It kind of sucks, but it is reality. It has made it hard for the guys who travel, but given a few more cracks at it, they will adapt and overcome. I do know that I would have a good time in Canton no matter what and I would meet great folks! I have been blessed to enjoy the company of a great crew of guys (and gal) here in Los Angeles and even more so, because of the visits from enthusiastic visitors like Weirdwolf, Mike Robertson, Mantarey Dre, Reggie, Pretty Boy and many more. Yeah...I am a PAC-10 homer, but I love what we have out here. I want to enjoy life more than I want to worry about winning. It is a game with little plastic men on a vibrating field. It is a toy from my childhood and it helps keep me young. I don't want a drive for glory to suck all the fun out of this hobby.

[artlax]

I know what you are trying to say - but I would consider EXPERTS or MASTERS more appropriate terms to describe the best in our game. To my knowledge none of our coaches make their living from competition in the game? Are there any tournaments or league that even give cash awards? Other than Miggle is their any coach or individual that makes their living SOLELY from miniature football business?

Like I said - I know what you are trying to say - just EXPERT or MASTER seem to be more fitting for a description.

[the french guy]

National title means bigger audience, and curiosity, than a local city league. Simply as that. Put country name + championship on a poster or flyer, and you'll find audience. Make the same poster, replace the country name by a city name, and the audience will not be there.


Not speaking of rules, pros or whatever. Just bring a national title to the hobby, and perhaps tommorow, a world title

To create that national title, you need local competitions to create local champions, wich will play regionaly under the same official rule, then will become regional champions under that particular official rule.

Then, these regional champs will play under the same official rule, and one will become national champion, under that official ruleset, endorsed by THE ONLY ONE OFFICIAL NATIONAL/INTERNATIONAL STRUCTURE THAT HOBBY HAS.

I don't get what 's the problem in here. If someone does not want to participate to that national championship, he just has to not participate, don't you think ?

[Megawattz]

Originally Posted by the french guy

National title means bigger audience, and curiosity, than a local city league. Simply as that. Put country name + championship on a poster or flyer, and you'll find audience. Make the same poster, replace the country name by a city name, and the audience will not be there.


Not speaking of rules, pros or whatever. Just bring a national title to the hobby, and perhaps tommorow, a world title

To create that national title, you need local competitions to create local champions, wich will play regionaly under the same official rule, then will become regional champions under that particular official rule.

Then, these regional champs will play under the same official rule, and one will become national champion, under that official ruleset, endorsed by THE ONLY ONE OFFICIAL NATIONAL/INTERNATIONAL STRUCTURE THAT HOBBY HAS.

I don't get what 's the problem in here. If someone does not want to participate to that national championship, he just has to not participate, don't you think ?

Thank u hommie! rules written by the coaches themselves, rattified by the MFCA!

[Megawattz]

Am I missing something? I havnt mentioned paying anyone, I consider myself a professional of many things rather I get paid or not. The word "PRO" only applies to those that choose to wear the label, through there dedication to the game, & "WILLINGNESS TO TRAVEL". Why do u guys keep tryin to apply anything ive suggested to the local level. There has always been a "National" agenda or effort to unite the community as a whole, all im suggesting is getting serious about it! Im not a member of any group or organization, never written a rule book, never organized a league, always accepted what was handed down to me from others. Never suggested or implemented any type of event where my products were exclusive. Im sure theres others that feel as I do, how to make it happen is the challenge.

[artlax]

Originally Posted by Megawattz

Here we are in "2010" playing a "Board Game" introduced roughly 60 yrs ago, in an age of high technology. Our membership is dropping, not growing and every year that passes it gets worse, while other hobbies such as ping pong, billiards, fooz ball, RC racing of all types, darts hell even scrabble has an audience & respect on the street, with no changes, Why dont we

Dimitri - in a post on another thread made these points which I think clearly describe the challenge facing us.

I teached the game to a friend, in about 1half hour he was ready to play. I won the game, but he was able to play, being a total beginner in american football. Since he's not a board game geek he didn't involved much, sadly. Since he 's not a board game geek. I believe in our countries, it's a point more important than being a football specialist.

"Here, "football specialists", for most of them, watch games on tv and sometimes play madden. You will not take them off their seat easily to do something with more involvement. Especially because, as in cheap american comedies, board games, miniature and stuff like that has that negative "geek" image (you know, typical image of the football captain making fun of the glasses guys of the high school chess club)."

I know when I share with people my miniature football involvement they often look at me as if I have 5 eyes or something. Most think the game is long gone and have no idea where it has evolved to. Wolf's recent interview was great - but as they say - seeing is believing - and the nice thing about the BAM playing at The Toy Wiz is we are right in the middle of everything and different "game geeks" and others check out what we are doing whenever we are there.

If we want to promote what we are doing we have to promote the game in high visibility areas whenever possible and represent ourselves in a completely positive manner. Tournaments in common areas of mall - not the conference room. Might not be as cozy - but highly visible. And as Miggle is the entry level outlet to this game we need to partner with them to host events out in view for all to see - it will should help them as well as all of us.